I think Gatti is a very underrated fighter in alot of boxing circles. He is a far different fighter then the one that lost to Manfredy and Oscar but alot of people dont really see it. I think Gatti is seriously a world class fighter. Buddy Mcgirt has molded him into a better technical fighter but he's still the guy with great knockout power and the heart of a champion.
Gattis is what - 5"8 5"9? Dorin is only 5"4. I remember watching the fight where he beat Spadafora (but was ripped off) thinking that I really dont see a great fighter in this guy. I think Spaddy is vastly overrated and a complete joke and I remember thinking that both of these guys are pretty beatable.
I dont see Dorin being able to outbox Gatti or knock him out. You couldnt knock Gatti out with a crowbar though. I think Gatti is the better fighter with a good size advantage and a great trainer who will come in with the right game plan.
But I'm probably a little biased here. I gotta admit that Arturo Gatti is my hero. I love him
and respect the hell out of his unbelievable heart. If youve seen Wilson Rodriguez and Gabe Ruleas and a couple of other fights I dont see how you cant love the man. The Wilson Rodriguez fight was probably the greatest fight I've ever seen in my life. Every year on the anniversary of that fight there should be a celebration and rememberance of that night. Something like memorial day. Then theres the beheading of Joey Gamache and a few other moments which could only be provided by the human highlight reel.
But I honestly believe that he is a world class fighter with awesome ring and war experience. I know what people say about the war thing, it can be a negative, but I think Gatti is a champion. As a matter of fact, I like his chances against Floyd and anybody else at 140.
[This message was edited by almly on June 27, 2004 at 03:57 PM.]
Gattis is what - 5"8 5"9? Dorin is only 5"4. I remember watching the fight where he beat Spadafora (but was ripped off) thinking that I really dont see a great fighter in this guy. I think Spaddy is vastly overrated and a complete joke and I remember thinking that both of these guys are pretty beatable.
I dont see Dorin being able to outbox Gatti or knock him out. You couldnt knock Gatti out with a crowbar though. I think Gatti is the better fighter with a good size advantage and a great trainer who will come in with the right game plan.
But I'm probably a little biased here. I gotta admit that Arturo Gatti is my hero. I love him
and respect the hell out of his unbelievable heart. If youve seen Wilson Rodriguez and Gabe Ruleas and a couple of other fights I dont see how you cant love the man. The Wilson Rodriguez fight was probably the greatest fight I've ever seen in my life. Every year on the anniversary of that fight there should be a celebration and rememberance of that night. Something like memorial day. Then theres the beheading of Joey Gamache and a few other moments which could only be provided by the human highlight reel.
But I honestly believe that he is a world class fighter with awesome ring and war experience. I know what people say about the war thing, it can be a negative, but I think Gatti is a champion. As a matter of fact, I like his chances against Floyd and anybody else at 140.
[This message was edited by almly on June 27, 2004 at 03:57 PM.]
almly.....broke your heart?......man,don`t throw down on a guy that you feel to personally strong about....take it from me....i threw down on marquez and was lucky to escape with my ass...
imo,gatti`s not a great fighter.....in this division,he`s not even in the top 3......maybe not even top 5.....
be careful....as soon as i pull some info together,i`ll come back and write this up....and
you should do the same...take a look at your opinion in written form...see if it holds water...
i see reasons for taking gatti...i touched him at -160.....but,i`m not sold...i may hedge my wager....
i need to lay out a complete analysis to really see how many pro`s and cons i can come up with...
i know,personally, i`ve pulled some boners lately.....be a little careful...
i`ll be back,bud....g.l.
imo,gatti`s not a great fighter.....in this division,he`s not even in the top 3......maybe not even top 5.....
be careful....as soon as i pull some info together,i`ll come back and write this up....and
you should do the same...take a look at your opinion in written form...see if it holds water...
i see reasons for taking gatti...i touched him at -160.....but,i`m not sold...i may hedge my wager....
i need to lay out a complete analysis to really see how many pro`s and cons i can come up with...
i know,personally, i`ve pulled some boners lately.....be a little careful...
i`ll be back,bud....g.l.
I guess my theory on this matchup is pretty simple. After watching Dorin fight Spaddy for 12 rounds I was thinking that this guys not really a finesse fighter - hes more of a brawler/banger. He's a guy who tries to overpower people. I dont believe that theres anyway that he can overpower Gatti. I think Gatti has more power than him, he's bigger, and I didnt see any awesome boxing skills from Dorin which would show that he could just outslick him.
The thing I'm weary about is making the same huge blunder as I did with Wright/Mosely. I only saw Winky fight a couple of times before that fight and thought I had him pegged. Then he came out against Mosely and I was like - this aint the guy I've seen in the past - so damn agressive. So I probably havent seen Dorins best stuff.
I dont know - tell me what you think when youve broke it down.
The thing I'm weary about is making the same huge blunder as I did with Wright/Mosely. I only saw Winky fight a couple of times before that fight and thought I had him pegged. Then he came out against Mosely and I was like - this aint the guy I've seen in the past - so damn agressive. So I probably havent seen Dorins best stuff.
I dont know - tell me what you think when youve broke it down.
Yeah, that was a pretty damn close fight but I think that Branco guy is a damn skilled boxer. These Euros are making some noise lately. You think that theyre just finesse guys with no cock and balls (like that Grigorian dude) and then you get a Branco or Strum.
I'm really not going to hold that against Gatti because I thought Branco is a quality fighter. The one other possible concern is with Gattis recent breakup with his fiance. When he was single he was going out and partying like a rock star and it had an effect on him in the ring. Then he hooked up with this broad and thats when he revived his career. Right around the time of his win over Terron Millet I believe.
Now he broke up with this broad and was crying at a recent press conference about it. I dont know, it sounds like he was a mentally focused guy when he was with her - I just hope he doesnt lose that now that theyre done.
I'm really not going to hold that against Gatti because I thought Branco is a quality fighter. The one other possible concern is with Gattis recent breakup with his fiance. When he was single he was going out and partying like a rock star and it had an effect on him in the ring. Then he hooked up with this broad and thats when he revived his career. Right around the time of his win over Terron Millet I believe.
Now he broke up with this broad and was crying at a recent press conference about it. I dont know, it sounds like he was a mentally focused guy when he was with her - I just hope he doesnt lose that now that theyre done.
i don`t want to come off as a gatti apologist.....i`ve been waiting for the right fight to come up so i could make some hay on the bloated rep and the overrated mcgirt factor......
but,branco was not a cupcake.....he`s a much bigger guy than dorin,who has been very inactive.....not to mention small....and has very little power....in a lower weight class...
gatti`s no world beater....he`s been handled very carefully by mcgirt.....
but,dorin has some serious disadvantages coming into this bout.....
not the bout i was hoping for...
but,branco was not a cupcake.....he`s a much bigger guy than dorin,who has been very inactive.....not to mention small....and has very little power....in a lower weight class...
gatti`s no world beater....he`s been handled very carefully by mcgirt.....
but,dorin has some serious disadvantages coming into this bout.....
not the bout i was hoping for...
I've got 13k and some change riding on this. If I lose this one I'm done trying to cap boxing and wont post anymore opinions on here because I cant pick my ass. Unless you guys want me to keep posting so you can fade me.
Anyway, this ones my baby. I'm going all in on it. I spent the day yesterday walking all over the strip line shopping. Almost every casino I was at had a line on the fight but not one had a line on Bojado vs Leija. Its funny how some of the Vegas lines are far different than offshore lines for some fights. At MGM and a couple of other places Marquez is -800 against the guy hes fighting and at Pinny and 5 dimes hes -500.
I got Gatti at -200 at a couple of places but they only let me lay 2 grand on it and the line jumped to -220 after that so I had to walk around and fight off the Mexicans trying to put sh!t in my hands all day.
What are you gonna do?
Anyway, this ones my baby. I'm going all in on it. I spent the day yesterday walking all over the strip line shopping. Almost every casino I was at had a line on the fight but not one had a line on Bojado vs Leija. Its funny how some of the Vegas lines are far different than offshore lines for some fights. At MGM and a couple of other places Marquez is -800 against the guy hes fighting and at Pinny and 5 dimes hes -500.
I got Gatti at -200 at a couple of places but they only let me lay 2 grand on it and the line jumped to -220 after that so I had to walk around and fight off the Mexicans trying to put sh!t in my hands all day.
What are you gonna do?
you guys beat me to it..great points on the size issue.....i heard teddy atlas say that dorin is the bigger guy?......??????4 inches in height....and maybe more than 10 pounds by fight time...atlas must be punchy......this is what i posted on another site...
"when considering this bout,i keep thinking back to the gatti/joey gamache fight.......gamache comes in at 141 in a supposed jr welterweight bout....and gatti "supposedly" makes weight(some suggested some shenanigans).....
then 24 hours later,gatti walks into the ring at 160!!!!!....and almost kills gamache....literally...effectively ends his career....it looks like a man vs a boy....
and gatti doesn`t look bloated or drained..he`s buff and super strong....like a legit jr middle or middleweight......he seems to have this drying out thing down to a science....almost...
now,here`s dorin coming in....a career lightweight(to be fair,dorin did fight several fights earlier in his career vs nondescript opponents around the jr welter weight limit)...coming in after having one fight in recent memory at 141..2 fights in the last 2 years.....very inactive......
he was short as a lightweight...with limited power as a lightweight....and if i`m not mistaken,dorin is more of a pressure fighter...a volume puncher that outworks guys....not a guy that can stand outside and dance around....or maybe i`m wrong....somebody help me out here....
..now he`s going to have to fight a much,much naturally bigger man....no doubt,a much stronger,heavier puncher....a guy that does have solid whiskers....has shown this vs much bigger punchers than dorin...and dorin is 34...maybe not "a hard" 34...surely gatti has many more "hard miles" on himself than does dorin...
i have to admit to being a guy waiting for the right spot to step in big(for me) vs gatti..and the prospect of somebody out-working... out-hustling gatti appeals to me..and i`m sure dorin has the better work rate...throws more punches.....and all this drying out and exorbitant weight gain prior to fights can lead to exacerbated swelling and late round fatigue that has plagued gatti and others on occasion who have dried out to make weight...the gatti i`ve seen over the last 3 or 4 years,is capable of losing on any given night...
..but,given all the physical disadvatages and dorin`s inactivity,i just don`t think this is it....
but,as i said,anything can happen in a gatti fight...cuts,for sure...for both guys...
which gatti shows up?....the new,improved boxer-puncher?....or the brawler?....
dorin,every time i`ve seen him, is a pressure fighter....a very tough guy.....will he change his style?....i doubt it...
i touched gatti at -160..i think he will start out boxing until dorin forces him to go backwards...i don`t think he can`t fight backing up.....if i was sure that dorin will absolutely pressure gatti,i would play the under small...because gatti will almost certainly revert back to his old warrior self if pushed...and he will be much bigger by fight time....and you must consider the cut and swell factor"......
anybody looking at tyson under 4.5?....some european friends are saying they think it will be quick...
"when considering this bout,i keep thinking back to the gatti/joey gamache fight.......gamache comes in at 141 in a supposed jr welterweight bout....and gatti "supposedly" makes weight(some suggested some shenanigans).....
then 24 hours later,gatti walks into the ring at 160!!!!!....and almost kills gamache....literally...effectively ends his career....it looks like a man vs a boy....
and gatti doesn`t look bloated or drained..he`s buff and super strong....like a legit jr middle or middleweight......he seems to have this drying out thing down to a science....almost...
now,here`s dorin coming in....a career lightweight(to be fair,dorin did fight several fights earlier in his career vs nondescript opponents around the jr welter weight limit)...coming in after having one fight in recent memory at 141..2 fights in the last 2 years.....very inactive......
he was short as a lightweight...with limited power as a lightweight....and if i`m not mistaken,dorin is more of a pressure fighter...a volume puncher that outworks guys....not a guy that can stand outside and dance around....or maybe i`m wrong....somebody help me out here....
..now he`s going to have to fight a much,much naturally bigger man....no doubt,a much stronger,heavier puncher....a guy that does have solid whiskers....has shown this vs much bigger punchers than dorin...and dorin is 34...maybe not "a hard" 34...surely gatti has many more "hard miles" on himself than does dorin...
i have to admit to being a guy waiting for the right spot to step in big(for me) vs gatti..and the prospect of somebody out-working... out-hustling gatti appeals to me..and i`m sure dorin has the better work rate...throws more punches.....and all this drying out and exorbitant weight gain prior to fights can lead to exacerbated swelling and late round fatigue that has plagued gatti and others on occasion who have dried out to make weight...the gatti i`ve seen over the last 3 or 4 years,is capable of losing on any given night...
..but,given all the physical disadvatages and dorin`s inactivity,i just don`t think this is it....
but,as i said,anything can happen in a gatti fight...cuts,for sure...for both guys...
which gatti shows up?....the new,improved boxer-puncher?....or the brawler?....
dorin,every time i`ve seen him, is a pressure fighter....a very tough guy.....will he change his style?....i doubt it...
i touched gatti at -160..i think he will start out boxing until dorin forces him to go backwards...i don`t think he can`t fight backing up.....if i was sure that dorin will absolutely pressure gatti,i would play the under small...because gatti will almost certainly revert back to his old warrior self if pushed...and he will be much bigger by fight time....and you must consider the cut and swell factor"......
anybody looking at tyson under 4.5?....some european friends are saying they think it will be quick...
Well people are betting on Dorin because every time I push the line up on 5dimes or Pinny it gets pushed back down. But god damn I wish I would of nailed this when it was at 160. Too bad I didnt have the allocated betting funds available at the time. Lingering effects of the Mosely fight.
I had to lay another dime on it today after reading an article at Fightnews where they interviewed 10 guys who are boxers in Montreal or in the Montreal boxing circle. All 10 of them picked Gatti. Thats my main concern for making this such a big play, I dont know much about Dorin because I've only seen him fight against Spaddy. But its somewhat reassuring that these Canucks that are familiar with him arent thinking he will win.
Spinch we take different approaches to capping these fights. You take a more technical boxing approach at this. Evaluating all the technical things that these guys do or dont do.
If I would have taken that approach more maybe I wouldnt have lost 13k on Mosely. But the approach I take seems to work for me most of the time. I pay attention to what the guy is made of alot. What he has for will power, his resolve, his refuse to lose and ability to find a way to win. Wilson Rodriquez, Gabriel Ruelas, and Floyd Patterson all were probably alot more technically sound than Gatti. But he has unreal heart and he is willing to die before losing. And he found a way to beat them all - in some cases taking a hellish beating before doing so. Youve been a more successful capper then me but thats something I think you should take into consideration more when capping a fight. How much of a winner the guy is.
This is why I feel so confident about betting Gatti. Something that possibly concerns me though is Buddy Mcgirt possibly watering down what he does best. I like Buddy Mcgirt and think he has done great things for Gatti but what Gatti does best is get in wars with guys to the point where boxing gets thrown out the window. Which is a good thing because alot of the guys he has beat are better boxers than him.
I just hope that he hasnt taken away Gattis warrior spirit to the point where he dosent do what he does best anymore.
I hope he's found a balance between boxing and brawling.
I had to lay another dime on it today after reading an article at Fightnews where they interviewed 10 guys who are boxers in Montreal or in the Montreal boxing circle. All 10 of them picked Gatti. Thats my main concern for making this such a big play, I dont know much about Dorin because I've only seen him fight against Spaddy. But its somewhat reassuring that these Canucks that are familiar with him arent thinking he will win.
Spinch we take different approaches to capping these fights. You take a more technical boxing approach at this. Evaluating all the technical things that these guys do or dont do.
If I would have taken that approach more maybe I wouldnt have lost 13k on Mosely. But the approach I take seems to work for me most of the time. I pay attention to what the guy is made of alot. What he has for will power, his resolve, his refuse to lose and ability to find a way to win. Wilson Rodriquez, Gabriel Ruelas, and Floyd Patterson all were probably alot more technically sound than Gatti. But he has unreal heart and he is willing to die before losing. And he found a way to beat them all - in some cases taking a hellish beating before doing so. Youve been a more successful capper then me but thats something I think you should take into consideration more when capping a fight. How much of a winner the guy is.
This is why I feel so confident about betting Gatti. Something that possibly concerns me though is Buddy Mcgirt possibly watering down what he does best. I like Buddy Mcgirt and think he has done great things for Gatti but what Gatti does best is get in wars with guys to the point where boxing gets thrown out the window. Which is a good thing because alot of the guys he has beat are better boxers than him.
I just hope that he hasnt taken away Gattis warrior spirit to the point where he dosent do what he does best anymore.
I hope he's found a balance between boxing and brawling.
not trying to scare you,almly....but i don`t know if wagering that much on gatti,who just could be damaged good,is a great idea....
check this out
GATTI-DORIN IS THE MATTER AT HAND!
When I strolled into the Media room in Bally’s, there sat Leonard "The Lion" Dorin. A capable fighter born behind what used to "The Iron Curtain" in Romania, Dorin is still unbeaten at 22-0-1, (8KO’s), after having relinquished the WBA lightweight (135 lbs) title because of weight woes. Across the ring Saturday night it’ll be Arturo Gatti (37-6, 28 KO’s) and an opportunity for Dorin to pick up a new belt, this time the WBC 140 lb. diadem should he be able to upset the odds and defeat "The Human Highlight Film" when HBO airs Gatti-Dorin and the curtain raiser Francisco Bojado-Jesse James Leija beginning Saturday night at 9:30 PM ET.
LEONARD "THE LION" DOESN’T FIT HIS PERSONA
As I watched the local Media ask Dorin the same questions over and over again this afternoon, I was marveled at his sense of relaxation. "Without question, this is the biggest fight of my life. Gatti can box, he can punch, and he has a good chin….and heart. But so do I. Gatti is perfect for me right now. I will win this fight for my fans and my homeland Romania. I must out think and then sometimes out fight Gatti," who comes in two years younger at 32 than Dorin. But that doesn’t mean a whole lot as Arturo has taken more punishment in just one of his fights with Ivan Robinson, Angel Manfredy, or in any of the three with Mickey Ward, than Dorin has in his 34 years of life and 23 professional fights.
ARTURO "MR. EXCITEMENT" IN DA’ HOUSE
Soon after the Dorin contingent left, in walked a guy hiding behind shades that looked a lot like Arturo Gatti. With facial bones protruding because of the weight loss and conditioning process, Gatti looked unbelievably gaunt to me. Nothing he said was revealing in his Media chat. But as Arturo talked, I looked at a man of whom I could see the residual effects of boxing taking hold. Always a free spirit, Gatti seemed to squint at times while chatting from a seated position. He looked tired, drawn, and beat up. And this is two days prior to the fight!
DOES THE "GATTI WAR MACHINE" GRIND TO A HALT HERE?
When I put up a "Betting Line" on Gatti’s first defense of the WBC jr. welterweight trinket, the Canadian now living in Jersey was a 14-5 choice. And while some circles have Gatti favored by a bit more, the bottom line is that this is a fight Arturo could very easily lose! That’s why I say, "Pass" on the betting here unless you want to thrown down on the "Underdog" Dorin to win. The intangibles here are many. 1. How done is Gatti? 2. Will Dorin feel the heat and choke? 3. Can Trainer Buddy McGirt squeeze one more win out of the 150-year old Gatti?
i keep thinking back to weak punching ivan robinson out-hustling gatti....
these are legit questions.......be careful,bud....
check this out
GATTI-DORIN IS THE MATTER AT HAND!
When I strolled into the Media room in Bally’s, there sat Leonard "The Lion" Dorin. A capable fighter born behind what used to "The Iron Curtain" in Romania, Dorin is still unbeaten at 22-0-1, (8KO’s), after having relinquished the WBA lightweight (135 lbs) title because of weight woes. Across the ring Saturday night it’ll be Arturo Gatti (37-6, 28 KO’s) and an opportunity for Dorin to pick up a new belt, this time the WBC 140 lb. diadem should he be able to upset the odds and defeat "The Human Highlight Film" when HBO airs Gatti-Dorin and the curtain raiser Francisco Bojado-Jesse James Leija beginning Saturday night at 9:30 PM ET.
LEONARD "THE LION" DOESN’T FIT HIS PERSONA
As I watched the local Media ask Dorin the same questions over and over again this afternoon, I was marveled at his sense of relaxation. "Without question, this is the biggest fight of my life. Gatti can box, he can punch, and he has a good chin….and heart. But so do I. Gatti is perfect for me right now. I will win this fight for my fans and my homeland Romania. I must out think and then sometimes out fight Gatti," who comes in two years younger at 32 than Dorin. But that doesn’t mean a whole lot as Arturo has taken more punishment in just one of his fights with Ivan Robinson, Angel Manfredy, or in any of the three with Mickey Ward, than Dorin has in his 34 years of life and 23 professional fights.
ARTURO "MR. EXCITEMENT" IN DA’ HOUSE
Soon after the Dorin contingent left, in walked a guy hiding behind shades that looked a lot like Arturo Gatti. With facial bones protruding because of the weight loss and conditioning process, Gatti looked unbelievably gaunt to me. Nothing he said was revealing in his Media chat. But as Arturo talked, I looked at a man of whom I could see the residual effects of boxing taking hold. Always a free spirit, Gatti seemed to squint at times while chatting from a seated position. He looked tired, drawn, and beat up. And this is two days prior to the fight!
DOES THE "GATTI WAR MACHINE" GRIND TO A HALT HERE?
When I put up a "Betting Line" on Gatti’s first defense of the WBC jr. welterweight trinket, the Canadian now living in Jersey was a 14-5 choice. And while some circles have Gatti favored by a bit more, the bottom line is that this is a fight Arturo could very easily lose! That’s why I say, "Pass" on the betting here unless you want to thrown down on the "Underdog" Dorin to win. The intangibles here are many. 1. How done is Gatti? 2. Will Dorin feel the heat and choke? 3. Can Trainer Buddy McGirt squeeze one more win out of the 150-year old Gatti?
i keep thinking back to weak punching ivan robinson out-hustling gatti....
these are legit questions.......be careful,bud....
this is only one report....gatti`s been doing this weight thing for years.....
i must say that i saw gatti interviewed the other day and his speech wasn`t exactly sharp....
you can always off a little if you get cold feet...
where is everyone else on this one....almly`s got big bucks tied up here...
i must say that i saw gatti interviewed the other day and his speech wasn`t exactly sharp....
you can always off a little if you get cold feet...
where is everyone else on this one....almly`s got big bucks tied up here...
Now Im really concerned. Fightnews.com, and I mean this is fightnews, stated that Gatti would be interviewed at ringside during the Maskaev fight. Instead we saw Buddy Mcgirt step in. Which means that if they are correct Gatti reneged and didnt sit down for the interview for some reason and instead Buddy had to.
I'm seriously considering buying some of this sh!t back. But then again its fightnews and they also stated that Yori Foremans fight on this undercard tonight would be televised.
So I dont know.
Im starting to get a bad feeling about this though.
I'm seriously considering buying some of this sh!t back. But then again its fightnews and they also stated that Yori Foremans fight on this undercard tonight would be televised.
So I dont know.
Im starting to get a bad feeling about this though.
espn showed film of the weight in....gatti looked o.k...
i don`t want to sway you either way here...i just don`t see this as a 13 grand fight....
to many ???? for me....anybody that`s lost to...
...ivan robinson twice...
was life and death with wilson rodriguez....and lil` joe hutchinson
....got destroyed by dlh(no shame there...was the smaller man to boot)..w
was taken apart by angel manfredy....
gatti fights are,as a rule....unpredictable....and mcgirt has matched him masterfully....
i admit,he does have many physical advantages in this fight..dorin`s stepping up in weight.....and dorin`s been inactive...
but,gatti has some very hard miles on him...
anybody else feel like they have a handle on this thing?
i don`t want to sway you either way here...i just don`t see this as a 13 grand fight....
to many ???? for me....anybody that`s lost to...
...ivan robinson twice...
was life and death with wilson rodriguez....and lil` joe hutchinson
....got destroyed by dlh(no shame there...was the smaller man to boot)..w
was taken apart by angel manfredy....
gatti fights are,as a rule....unpredictable....and mcgirt has matched him masterfully....
i admit,he does have many physical advantages in this fight..dorin`s stepping up in weight.....and dorin`s been inactive...
but,gatti has some very hard miles on him...
anybody else feel like they have a handle on this thing?
